Rabbi Osdoba: “I Never Gave Permission for Messira C”V!”


Taken From ch.info

After speaking to both Rabbis Osdoba and Schwei they told us how they were hurting not only from the false statements in their name in this matter, but many others that have come out over the years. Rabbi Avrohom Osdoba released yesterday this letter in his defense, and that of the Shomrim Six. “Since it has been said in my name as if I heaven forbid gave permission to give over [Masser] and to inform [Malshin] on the members of Shomrim. I am here to clarify that this is a complete and total lie, and it is entirely not in my hands, since this sort of act is prohibited by Halacha in every way possible.”

[free translation]

Since there has been said in my name as if I heaven forbid gave permission to give over [Masser] and to inform [Malshin] on the members of Shomrim. I am here to clarify that this is a complete and total lie, and it is entirely not in my hands, since this sort of act is prohibited by Halacha in every way possible. Shulchan Aruch Choshen Mishpat, Siman Shin Pey Ches Seiif Tes, and in the Alter Rebbes Shulchan Aruch Choshen Mishpat Dinei Nizkei Mamon Seiif Vov: “it is prohibited to give over a Jew in to the hands of a non-jew both physically and both financially… both to do so in speech to inform on him or to reveal his intentions… and that who does so has no part in the world to come.”

It is clear and understood that it is permitted to call that police if he need immediate rescuing from a beating but immediately after one must call the parties to a Din Torah, and then it is upon the Beis Din to decide if it is permitted to continue with it.

And even further more in relation to a claim and prosecution that comes two years later, that this has no place to be discussed in the courts at all. As it is explained in the Shailos U’Teshuvos of the Ram”a Siman Pey Ches: “it seems that is isn’t relevant to this discussion, that specifically at that time during his anger it is understandable like is says in the Peskei Merizbur”g, but if he forgot his initial anger is plain and simple that it is not permitted.”

Furthermore, Messira is a horrible sin [lit. “criminal offense”] and is unthinkable [lit. “totally unacceptable”]. If they have any kind of claim, they must bring it before a Beis Din of Jews, and it is absolutely prohibited to indict them and to testify against them in a court of gentiles. As its is explained in the Shulchan Aruch Chosen Mishpat Siman Chof Vov Seiif Alef: “it is prohibited to deliberate before those who worship idols and in their courts…, even if the their law is a equivalent to Jewish law, even if both parties agreed to go before them on a claim, it is prohibited. And those who go before such a court, is an evil person, and it is as if he spites and scorns, curses and raises his hand to the torah of Moshe Rabainu of blessed memory. And it is in the hands of a Beis Din to judge him and excommunicate him [place him in Cherem] until he removes the idol worshipers from above his friends (Mahari”k Shoresh Kuf Nun Daled). And so would they excommunicate any who assists those who go before idol worshippers (Rivas”h Siman Kuf Beis).

This letter comes in direct contrast to that of these ‘alleged victims’ that has been circulating on certain agenda filled websites, and in Pashkvillen on the doorsteps of homes in Crown Heights, claim that they had the permission of Rabbonim to go to court, and that Rabbi Osdoba dismissed the Din Torah.

As we have reported these vicious individuals used the Hazmana to the Din Torah in court attempting to have the six defendants remanded and locked up for the duration of this long, tedious and expensive trial. And these are the same people that so callously twisted and used the names of Rabbonim to further their own agenda, with blatant disregard for the respect of the Rabbonim of this community.

The expenses for such a criminal defense trial amount in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, and this is a matter of Pidyon Shuvim. You can make your donations to the Shomrim Defense Fund by credit card at ShomrimDefense.com or call the Shomrim hotline (718) 774-3333 after 6:00pm to arrange someone to come and pick up your contribution. Additionally you can mail in your contribution to: Shomrim Defense Fund 537 East New York Avenue Brooklyn, NY 11225.


9 Responses to “Rabbi Osdoba: “I Never Gave Permission for Messira C”V!””

  1. antimesira Says:

    watch how the haters/mossrim will now accuse the Shomrim six and anybody whom supports Shomrim/the community of (don’t laugh)

    anyways, its about time a letter like this came out.

    my question now is. will all the people who cared so much to actually believe the propaganda change their minds after seeing the truth.
    will these “caring” people show up in court to see the truth?

    we will have to see.

  2. Chutzpa of Esav vs. Chutzpa of Yaakov Says:

    They have a Chutzpa of Esav, Darkness ans evil.
    We must fight back with a Chutzpa of Yaakov, with light and good deeds.

    The more they spread hate the more they show who they are.

    Darkness is the absents of light!
    Darkness has no existents of its own!

  3. antimesira Says:

    “When word got out about that detectives were looking for the Shomrim members, Shomrim turned to Rabbi Schwei, a prominent member of the Rabbinical Court (of Crown Heights) for help. He heard all that they had to say and simply answered ” I don’t want to take such people on” (!?)”

  4. Anonymous Says:

    What about mesira on Shuchat?

    • WhoIsShmira? Says:

      What about it, do you have a solid information on what in fact happened with mr.Shuchat?

      Information that has come to WIS is that the same people, the shmira mesira that are behind
      the shomrim six mesira are the same people that screwed Shuchat.

      Mesira is wrong no matter who, what and when.

      Anybody who does have any more information on the Mesira of Shuchat, please write in.
      who told him to run (leave the country) and why?

    • and the mossrin are... Says:

      If you want to know the answer to your question, one that I and many by the way also have, just ask….

      Yossi Stern
      Yanky Prager
      Leib Skoblo
      D.L. Wolosow
      Ezra Hecht
      Menachem Kozlovsky
      Mordy Hecht
      Paul ‘Levi’ Huebner
      Yitzchok ‘Carlos’ Korolitzky


  5. Hershkop Family Says:

    Letter to Rabbi Schwei By Hershkop Family

    On 5 Kislev the following letter was sent to Rabbi Schwei informing him about the current situation with the Mesira on Six of our community members who volunteer in Shomrim Chesed organization. In this letter Rabbi Schwei is being informed of how many are misusing his name (in a public way) to justify this vicious Messira (a modern day blood libel), he is asked many questions about his said involvement. upen receiving this letter, Rabbi Schwei promised a full response by the following Shabbos (11 Kislev- November 28). Shabbos has come and gone and no responds.

    5 Kislev 5770 (November 22, 2009)

    Dear Rabbi Schwei:

    You are most certainly aware of the fact that there is a court case going on in secular court, and you have stated clearly that it is forbidden to do so without explicit permission from a competent Rav.

    Recently a flier was distributed to all the homes in Crown Heights, it was sent from our opponents who claim to speak on your behalf (they also posted it on the official website of your followers called Chabad.info). In the flier they claim that you, Rav Schwei and Rav Osdoba gave them permission to take us to court. Rav Osdoba immediately issued a public letter in which he completely denies such claims, and he stated that he never gave them permission to go to court, and that those who went to court are evil people who have no share in the world to come.

    It is obvious that this court case causes a tremendous violation of Hashem’s name.
    Everyday, for the last three weeks G-d’s names is desecrated and the name of Lubavitch has been dragged down to the gutter.

    The court appointed a jury of non-Jews and they are hearing and seeing on a daily basis how Chasidic Jews are fighting amongst themselves. They are hearing about all the garbage that goes on in Crown Heights replete with lies and incitement against Jews, etc. All this is done in your name and the name of your Beth Din who purportedly permitted them to go to court. They even publicized this claim that you gave them this permission in a letter to the entire community (and through their website to the entire world).

    So our question to you is: Is it true that you gave them permission to go to court?! And if so, when and where did you properly investigate this matter before you issued such a ruling?!

    In reality you refused to get involved and refused to hear the other side claiming that you don’t have the power or the manpower to get involved! And if in truth you didn’t give permission to go to court then why aren’t you issuing a letter against those who are spreading lies in your name? And if for whatever reason you are unable to publicly deny their claim that you gave permission (for unfortunate reasons of politics, etc.), then on you the Chachamim said “since you are silent you must agree with it.”

    Did you know that they are attempting to put 6 Jews in prison?! Did you know that four of them are family men and fathers of children?!
    Do you know that these defendants are unable to work for the last three weeks?
    Do you remember the good old fashioned government appointed Rabbonim in the dark days of Russia of old?!
    Do you take responsibility for these horrendous Mesira and government informers?!

    Haven’t we suffered enough from the Mesira’s against the Rubashkin family, heaven forbid? Which, by the way, your people are part of the gang that ratted on Moshe Rubashkin and had him sent to prison, and they also attempted to inform on Rav Moshe Bogomilsky.

    Our sages already commented: “from evil people evil comes forth” and “one transgression leads to another transgression.”

    P.S. If it is true that this abomination was approved by you then you are destined to pay for it in this world and the world to come.

    We wish to remind you (since your memory fails you to remember if you gave permission….) the words of the Rambam in the laws of Sanhedrin: “it is forbidden for a judge to hear one side of the litigants before the other one is present or in his absence and even one word is forbidden (to listen to) as it says you must listen to your brothers (plural). And if (a judge) hears only one side he transgressed a Torah violation as it says you should not bear vain claims which includes a warning to one who accepts evil talk (loshon hora) and one who says loshon hora and one who testifies falsely (as we see everyday in court).

    Rambam Sanhedrin 23, 8: “forever a judge should feel as if a sword is applied to his neck and the gates of hell are open beneath him and he should know whom he is judging and in front of whom he is judging and who will ultimately make him pay (for his ruling) if he deviates from the truth as it says G-d stands among a community of G-d, etc.”

    Rambam Sanhedrin 23,9: “every judge who doesn’t rule according to the ultimate truth causes the Shechina (G-d’s presence) to withdraw its presence from amongst the Jews and every judge who takes from one and gives to the other unjustly against Halacha, G-d collects from him lives … And every judge who rules according to the truth even for one hour he is considered as if he corrected the entire world and he causes the Shechina (G-d’s presence) to dwell amongst the Jewish people as it says, G-d stands amongst the community of G-d.”

    I suppose that on you it is said: “I said that you are G-dly and that you are sons of man, indeed like man…., etc.”
    “Arise G-d judge this world – Pursue Justice!”

    Suffering over the public desecration of G-d’s name.
    Where there is desecration of G-d’s name you don’t give honor to….

    A United Hershkop Family


    • zalmanzezmer@gmail.com Says:

      wow! what a chutzpa! what a disgrace!
      to write such a way to a rov, and noch be proud of it!
      (this just fortifies my belief that rabbi schwei is a true memaleh makom for rabbi marlow).

      • machanemenachem Says:

        Yes, what a chutzpa of the Rambam to write these things, what a Chutzpa of the Torah (Parshas Mishpatim and that Rashi guy, who does he think he is?) to write such things about a Rov. It’s really sad for “your Rov” that you came to a conclusion that hes guilty and that hes going to hell.

        “this just fortifies my belief that rabbi schwei is a true memaleh makom for rabbi marlow”
        May R. Schwei if guilty of the above be Zocher (Merit) to the same death as the great and mighty Marlow who also allowed Messira to happen under his watchful eye.
        Jewish blood is not cheap.
        P.S. if you are taking a stand with these “great Rabbis” may you also be Zocher in there rewards.
        Ask you “rabbi” how he allowes six Jews to be prosecuted and be silenced, now that a Chutzpa.
        320 Jay Street, come see the Lubavitcher Rebbe sitting on the stand.

        Gut Voch!
        G-d Bless,
        be a mensch, its never to late to do Tishuva,

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